Remove the top of the machine and locate the boiler thermal switch. I figured a video about this could be of interest to you, so here's the link: P, I, d, controlling period, digital filter coefficient, and more (for control theory experts only) Using pliers to pull the connectors can pinch them on even more tightly, making them extremely difficult to remove. Can the PID be put inside the machine or does size constraints and/or heat negate that option? Hi Chris. I would not try anything without checking first. Thanks for putting it together, this has helped me a lot in figuring out most of my doubts with a PID project for a Gaggia. You will be working with potentially lethal mains voltages. I have a similar model, C100-Fk02-V*AN. $15.59. Its crazy. 103 or 105 is good. Chris has done a great job on this write up and its easy to follow. Did you try it? Do you think its going to blow my machine if I dont do correctly? Tighten one end of your connector down to one of the solid state relays AC (~) terminals and plug the other end into one of the disconnected thermostat wires. Current Status. Hi Chris, gaggia_classic_pro_pid. Hi Murat. If you do this, consider counter-sinking the magnet so that it is flush with the outisde of the box. I had no issues with the K type thermocouple. Sure enough, it powered up. When set up on my bench it tucks away nicely in behind out of sight and only needs to come out when in use. Ill try to get a new thermostat from a reputable place, see if that solves the problem, and if it remains then something else in the machine is wrong. I recently installed the PID kit mentioned above however, the water coming out of my group head is substantially lower than my SV (currently set at 200F, reading 165-170F at the group head). Does this pid control both the group head water and steam wand? Do you observe the same temperature ranges? As for you steam mode question, if you followed this guide for installing your PID, the PID will have no effect on the the steam temperatures or functions. You want to connect the PIDs mains power terminal to the side of the Gaggia power switch that cuts out power when the machine is off. It heats up to 93 +-1c and then goes down as soon as i hit the switch brew. Did you make any changes to the setting of the PID? But, I still get loads of steam and spray before it settles down. My steam bottoms out around 130 or so, and I dont start steaming until 135-145. The PID unit did not turn on using the same terminal of your machine. They are not polarized so you can connect either one to either terminal of the SSR. Thanks for the great guide. My Gaggia Classic uses 18 awg wire for every connection inside. Thanks. Close the PID enclosure, and attach it to the side of the Classic. Note that according to this video: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UETVv0qgz-w, you can switch the C-100 between Celsius and Fahrenheit. My Gaggia Classic Pro Controller (PID, flow control, brew profiles, and more!) I formatted the table, its very useful. You said here that the to get an M3 thread for the boiler. So the above instructions might not apply to the UK, I have the GC2019 but the live connection was the top right on the power switch when switched on, bottom left caused the PID to flicker and not work as expected, I fixed my issue but now the PID readout is 103 Dec but the water is 80 degrees, didnt think it would be off by this much. Do you have any diagram of the wiringi cant understand how to switch on the steam circuit so the second SSR would not try to heat the boiler in parallel. In the text it says M4, but on the picture, it highlights to use the M3. One question, Ever thought about adding a pre infusion feature? I would re-crimp any connections that look suspicious. Perfect, came back here to ask this question! This is really a DIY project. Ill verify the cable, its one of the cables that came with the machine, so it could likely be the strands have slowly burned with time and just needs cutting and re-crimping, as you mention. This steam blipping is a fairly common practice that people use to avoid boiler heater cycling, its just another way to do temperature surfing. Plug in a mains-rated cable connected to a piggyback spade connector, and then plug the original switched mains cable into the piggyback. From what you describe, it looks the power wires for your PID are possibly tapped in-line with the boiler power? It is a really tight fit to get the REX C-100 PID inside the machine. Otherwise, it all works properly now. The value proposition goes right out the window at that point because you're now at nearly $700 if you bought the machine new. Just use a multimeter to find the switched mains, and you should be able to follow the thermostat wires. Hi David. Thank you very much if you find the time to answer me . That controller is an interesting find. My Gaggia Classic Pro Controller (PID, flow control, brew profiles, and more!) Because there is very little information on how to install a PID on the latest generation of the New Classic (2018 and newer, also called the Gaggia Classic Pro in North America), here are instructions on to do this. robert kujawa 348 subscribers Subscribe 85K views 1 year ago In this video I'll install a PID unit on my. 15,00 . I dont own a multimeter. it does not matter if the bean is dark or light roast? Thank you Chris for the awesome write up. Yesterday I replaced the group head gasket. It was impossible to see without getting down into the wire harness. To set the target temperature, press the Set button on the front of the panel. Thanks a lot for the answer. 1 / 9. Spent a relaxing boxing day fiddling around with this mod. Also some pids come with a built in relay. So far the temp range Ive seen when the heater cycles on/off (after ~30 mins of warming up) is ~90C to ~97C. Nevertheless, it will take some time to get it and make a change of the temperature sensor. Chris, this is a far simpler way to add preinfusion. Do you know of any shops that can do this install or maybe you would be interested in working on my machine? Gaggia Stainless Steel 2 Cup Filter Basket with Pin Pressurised Crema 21000491. i heard from some that the PT100 with the M4 is more accurate. The way I wired the PID leaves it powered on as long as the main power switch is on. Make sure that all the new and repositioned wires are cleanly routed away from the boiler and pump and any uninsulated connectors. 40A SSR Solid state relay included It seems the wiring varies even within model years, and between model regions. The YouTube video from wll about replacing the boiler made the whole thing very easy. Implement an aggressive derivative to kick the PID output to maximum as soon as it starts to see a drop in boiler housing temperature. I have a 2018 wiring schematic and verified that the three switches correspond to the original configuration. Double sided tape will work. Although this is optional, it is difficult to access the power switch to tap power for the PID, and it is almost impossible to reach the thermostat without moving the boiler, and the boiler cant be moved unless the steam wand is removed. Gaggia Classic Pro PID kit components and summary 2,765 views Jun 4, 2021 30 Dislike Share Save Murat ztrk 65 subscribers In this video you can find information about the Gaggia Classic Pro. Have you noticed any problem using REX-C100FK02 and RTD PT100? The little red collar shows the location. Do not over-tighten the adapter, it only needs to be finger-tight. I hesitate to identify wires by their color, as the wire colors in the Gaggia seem to vary from year to year and from region to region. Hey Chris, Drip Tray Grid Gaggia Classic (pre 2018 model) Straight Lines from Stainless Steel. Have you written an article regarding installing a Gaggiuino mod? I am not surprised that the steam kit made little difference. Thanks for the PID info. If you have never done this before, know that you are working with live household current, and this can kill you. Converting CUSIP-6, CUSIP-8 and CUSIP-9 to ISIN in PHP, How to automatically block WordPress bot spam without a plugin, which I ordered as an inexpensive kit with a thermocouple and a solid state relay, PID installation in Gaggia Classic causing shortcircuits ColorMag, https://wiki.wholelattelove.com/File:GAGGIA_CLASSIC_2019_Wiring_Schematic.pdf, https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=UETVv0qgz-w, https://coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/53319-what-temp-offset-are-you-using-with-your-pid/, https://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/195229/in-a-light-switch-how-can-i-tell-if-the-black-wire-is-really-hot-and-the-white, https://www.reddit.com/r/espresso/comments/owpfe7/i_made_a_lego_enclosure_for_rex_c100_pid/, https://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00LODGP2E/ref=ppx_yo_dt_b_asin_image_o05_s00?ie=UTF8&psc=1, https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4243840, https://www.thingiverse.com/thing:4938828, https://www.reddit.com/r/gaggiaclassic/comments/l5tfcj/mr_shades_pid_installed_decided_to_mount_inside, https://calbryant.uk/blog/well-integrated-pid-temperature-control-of-a-gaggia-classic-espresso-machine/#better-temperature-regulation, https://www.vertex-qis.co.uk/Manuals/PT100_con.pdf, https://photos.app.goo.gl/8yPwJcEPDi1c5tfY7, https://photos.app.goo.gl/Xp37S3o3y6bqqrEk8, https://www.shadesofcoffee.co.uk/post-2018/gaggia-classic-2019ri9480power-switch-mod, Barista Tools that are Worth their Weight in Gold. The enclosures purpose is first to protect you from the mains current, and second, to make it easier to attach the PID to the Gaggia. Wire colors and positions seem to vary. I am glad you got your setup working Murat. You can take a look at this discussion about offset in the Gaggia Classic: https://coffeeforums.co.uk/topic/53319-what-temp-offset-are-you-using-with-your-pid/. Tags Gaggia Classic Pro Tool Holster. From what I have read, the PID with the additional steam mode option does not improve things much. Id been trying various methods of temp surfing, resulting in long waits and wasted water, but most importantly mediocre shots. I printed everything using Inland PLA+ filament. gaggia classic pro pid installation guideAUBER PID for gaggia classic proThis is a walkthrough / guide on ins. You can do this by dipping the thermocouple into water and ice, and/or boiling water. It can be installed on Gaggia Classic, Gaggia Coffee, and Gaggia Coffee Deluxe espresso machines. I ran the Autotuning function couple of times and I am always getting the following values for P, I and D parameters: P=620 , I=32, D=8. Mounting Dimension: DIN: 1/16 (48mmX48mmX80mm) The REX-C100 should work out of the box, set for heating mode, with alarms disabled, and units set to Celsius. The PID is really converting the mains voltage to 12VDC both for its internal operation and to drive the SSR, so the PIDs draw is quite small. Also, the diagram of the controller lists SSR to connects to terminals 9 & 10. https://www.vertex-qis.co.uk/Manuals/PT100_con.pdf. Do I need to make any adjustments to your procedure to make the PID handle the steam only (not caring about the group head)? Its pretty straightforward. The most I can say is these work for me, and are probably not optimum. Double check that this is the neutral! Universal Input: Thermo Resistor: PT100, Cu50 . Do you know how to do this? If in doubt, sit it out, and get some help. Obviously the actual water temp will be different, but I can use this range to try and get a consistent temp when I pull a shot. Hi Ray. https://photos.app.goo.gl/8yPwJcEPDi1c5tfY7 If the brand or source is questionable, I would recommend derating the current by a factor of 2 or 3 and going for a model rated for 25-40A just to be safe. In it's current revision, the Arduino board is still powered via USB so there needs to be an opening to plug in the USB cable. Neutral is the return path for the hot or load wire. I recently added a DIY PID controller to my Gaggia Classic Pro and filmed the entire process. (To be certain, the M4 is the correct one). Works on both US 110V and EU 220V machines.Parts existing in the video:LED light kit: https://coffee-sensor.com/product/gaggia-classic-or-pro-water-tank-led-. So this suggests that the machine is getting much hotter and I reduced the the set point to 95deg from your recommendation of 103degC. I am thinking to upgrade my classic pro more compact version with below controller. 39. r/espresso 24 days ago. Many thanks for such a comprehensive write up of your project. If nothing happens, download Xcode and try again. Thanks so much for the awesome guide! Thanks. I plan on doing the same thing as you did, bought both PID simply because the QB-T7100 is slimmer the case is readily accessible from mr. shades, compared to the higher cost of 3d printing a case for the REX. I am guessing that its caused by the current draw of the boiler heater. Again, as above, run this cable out the back, and leave it unterminated and longer than needed. Hi Kez. Also noticed if you use the steam for the milk it takes a lot of time to go back down (10min) to the set temp(i do run water through the boiler to bring the temp down, but it floats at a higher temp for a bit), does the steam affect the PID calculation or dont I need to worry about it? This will keep things looking tidy. i ordered K type and PT100 both for M4. Pretty much any material should work fine as the outside of the Gaggia never gets hot enough to melt most thermoplastics. I am glad you solved the problem, Murat. There are several PID kits that are available for the Gaggia, the most popular ones are by Mr. Hi Andrue. The A vs E should not make a difference as I am not using alarm function, and am using it with a 3-wire PT100. The fun of the PID is not just the great stability, but the ability to fine tune the brew temperature to your taste! How do I ensure that Im tapping the neutral mains? People are reporting a difference of up to 24 deg F / 13 deg C between the PID/thermocouple and the water temp. These connectors are hard to reach, and are on very tight. Thats what Auber and Shades use, although they make their own. Main Feature. For the wiring inside the PID I just used 32AWG single strand hookup wire and for any wiring inside the Gaggia I used silicone insulated wire (26AWG for the wiring from PID to SSR, 12AWG to extend the thermoswitch leads to the SSR as referenced in the Installation Steps below). Hello Chris, Remove this thermal switch and replace it with the M4 thermocouple, making sure to add thermal compound if necessary. You may need to extend the leads depending on where you decide to mount the SSR. Chris, do you recall what size flat head screw was used on the 3d printed box for the REX-100? Required fields are marked *. Hi Jun, glad you found this helpful. I should pointed out that the temperature ranges I was referring to were with the -8C offset on the PID. The Gaggia Classic has a max power consumption of more than 1400W, which can easily burn up a cheap SSR. But follow chriss advice and be careful and you should be OK. And also use a rubber grommet to route your wires through the slots in the back of the chassis. I think this is why using a separate SSR and controller is the only way to go. Once the machine has been set to 9 bars of pressure (see bottom of article), the next big improvement is the addition of a PID. So I would say yes, you should use a heat sink, but the Gaggia body conveniently provides you with that function. Also really awesome write up. Did you try with the SSR unit 40 DA or 40AA? Left or right side if facing the front of the machine? Supposed to be faster in detecting temperature changes and more accurate with the measurement. My P value is quite a lot different than yours. The cable between the SSR and boiler heating element needs to be heavier, at least 14 awg, and ideally silicone-coated. Be careful, the edges of the hole in the chassis are very sharp. Hi Miguel. Work fast with our official CLI. The PID I ordered came as a package with a solid state relay and a thermocouple, but that thermocouple had too big a diameter to with the Gaggia. Water tank lid custom made for Gaggia Classic pre 2018 model stainless steel. I dont bother with offset, once I have a temperature dialed in, it doesnt matter whether its measured at the boiler or offset for the group head. How to install a pid on the gaggia classic pro. Hi Chris, i noticed you used the K type thermocouple with the M4. For the Classic Pro, this requires either shortening the spring in the OPV valve through trial and error, or ordering a spring kit from Mr. M2x8mm screws of your choise (I used these: Rare earth magnets (optional), attached to the back of the SSR to fasten it to the inside of the espresso machine. I might even have the original box. 4.6 de 5 estrellas 1,758 calificaciones. If the wiring was done correctly, the PID should power up when the Classic is turned on. Possibly not the optimal position but was really easy to install and I knew Id only be getting a relative indicative temperature anyway. I appreciate the write up, and I believe it will help people doing this upgrade. My previous comment did not format the way I wanted the table data to look. The MCP9600 board is fastened with a screw to the small ledge inside the 3D printed box. This guide explains this well, and also explains what to do if your home wiring is not correct: https://diy.stackexchange.com/questions/195229/in-a-light-switch-how-can-i-tell-if-the-black-wire-is-really-hot-and-the-white. Thanks in advance! Ive seen the steaming power on the classic remains solid from 125C and up, anything below that results in mediocre steaming power, which makes me wonder if I just have an aftermarket part that shouldnt be on this machine, or is just signs of imminent failure. Approach 2: Divert from my writeup by installing the thermocouple so that it replaces the steam thermostat, and set the PID temperature to your preferred steam temperature. 3. There is definitely something weird going on. Final note: before going down the PID route, the easiest modification to make, and the best starting point for Gaggia Classic modifications, is lowering the brew pressure. Ill be using a xmt7100 (modified) for two SRRs and also tweaked for 12v out for led mod any help would be appreciated. Thanks in advance for any reply! Im using a calibrated FLUKE 51II digital thermometer and a K-type thermocouple to measure temp. Just leave the SSR disconnected, or dont install it at all. You wont need the heat sink, the GCs case does that job for you. I tested the current with multimeter and it is showing DC 100V when I turn on the on-off switch. Thanks for your time. Does this mean that I have made the connection properly? This was built on an Adafruit Metro Mini, which is directly compatible with the Arduino Uno R3, but you can use any Arduino board as long as it has enough pins and it supports I2C. The grommet is used where the wires go through the chassis. . This prompted me to look for alternate solutions. Glad you got that sorted out. I installed the PID so that there are no permanent modifications to the machine, and the Gaggia can be returned to factory condition at any time. One end is connected to the mains connector at the back (where it is showing N sign), the other end is connected to the back of the on off switch (as you showed on the picture above). (Markings can be found on front side of the plug) 2-Check the color of the cable which shows L sign on the plug- meaning Live. It would be almost impossible for me to give you a complete list of the parts from Mr Shades that you will need, as it will depend on the PID and SSR models you order. In this video I'll install a PID unit on my Gaggia Classic Pro. Then the PID will only switch on when the boiler temperature drops below the target temperature. Leave this cable longer than needed for now, it will be trimmed and terminated later. Then use the cursor keys to select the digits to increase and decrease. Ive tried connecting these in various combinations but the PV readout is 3 or 4. Perhaps Ill use a spare Arduino or FPGA to PWM the boiler while brewing as someone else was saying. Perhaps your steam thermostat is indeed not working quite as well as expected. However with the new steaming alarm system, I get a decrease around 10 degrees in steaming temperature as soon as AA SSR shuts down the boiler at the temperature I set, even it turns on right away (my setting is AL:156 AH:155 degrees Celcius). But I wondered if anyone has had the same problem and already found the answer! ESP32 IO. Learn what's in the box, how to setup the reservoir, filter basket types and how to use them, water quality,. Ring crimp connectors that fit the SSR need to be for M3 bolt, here's an example: https://amzn.to/3xcWBCq5. Has a black power coat paint finish, done by the vendor or manufacturer. However I dont know if my unit is properly calibrated and/or has a proper offset. that will make it where only one SSR is needed. Did you reverse any wires to the steam switch? 102 is way too low, you wont get useful steaming at that low a temperature. I also cleaned the part of the group head that that gasket sits in. Never used a K type so I cant say for sure. as a cheap indicator to assist with surfing. . This works well with a PID for light & medium roasts. This approach would give you a somewhat unique machine that has a factory thermostat-controlled brew mode, and a PID-controlled steam mode. Input. Thanks! The PID values are not saved if you change them through the menu so if you find a tuning you like and want to change the defaults, you'll need to do that in the code and then re-upload it to the device. The PID works after hooking everything up. Your machine would bottom out at 122C with the offset before power cycling again, which sounds more in line with much better steaming pressure. The PID has been setup with values for Kp, Ki and Kd that work adequately but you may want to adjust them to suit your needs. This does mean that you can only fill the water tank by pulling it out. Following your idea, I have ordered the same type of REX-C100FK02-V*EN and I combined with PT100 (RTD) sensor. - YouTube I followed the instructions to install the Mr Shades PID and finally I have power directed to the right places in my. It is the perfect place. Your email address will not be published. Hi Justin. Hi Anton. One bit of note and a request. Hello, thanks for the nice and valuable text. It should work as a replacement for the C-100 and SSR, but because the SSR is built into the PID, so your wiring will be a bit different. From what I gather, youre located in the lower mainland (B.C.)? If your connection is down to just a few strands, that will generate heat. Perhaps you are refering to the video by Damian Witonski. Because the PID runs on mains voltages, an enclosure is required. How to install a pid on the gaggia classic pro. Once these bolts are removed, the boiler can be moved around without having to disconnect any hoses or wires. Hi Tom. I had to manually enable autotuning on my REX-C100 and i dont know if other values are screwed up or if its something else, since it really does seem like the boiler is getting power in bypass of whatever the PID is doing. I will monitor it over the next few days, but if the coffee takes good, and the only thing I notice is the warmer cup tray, Ill be fine with that, better in fact! 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Heat negate that option tapping the neutral mains to a piggyback spade connector, and accurate! Then plug the original configuration that function idea, I still get loads of and! The machine or gaggia classic pro pid install size constraints and/or heat negate that option right places in my also the... It out, and a K-type thermocouple to measure temp and I dont know my. Size constraints and/or heat negate that option happens, download Xcode and try again would say yes you. Away from the boiler made the whole thing very easy but I wondered if anyone has the... Not polarized so you can connect either one to either terminal of the Classic add thermal if! This thermal switch temperature, press the set point to 95deg from your recommendation of 103degC made!